Mitchell Joachim访谈 | Arch2O
Conversation With Mitchell Joachim | Arch2O

由专筑网李佳琪，王帅编译

Mitchell Joachim，博士，美国建筑师协会成员，[jo-ak-um]——Terreform ONE联合创始人，同时也是NYU（纽约大学）的副教授。曾工作于Gehry  Partners LLP和贝考弗（Pei Cobb Freed）建筑事务所。被授予富布莱特奖以及TED、Moshe Safdie、麻省理工学院的Martin 可持续发展协会的奖金。《连线》杂志将其列入“智慧榜单：下一任总统应该倾听的15人”。《滚石》杂志也将他选为“正在改变美国的100人”之一。Mitchell获得过多项奖项，包括：AIA纽约城市设计奖、维克多•帕帕奈克（Victor Papanek）社会设计奖、Zumtobel可持续设计奖、Architizer A+奖、Infiniti历史未来城市奖以及《时代》杂志“麻省理工学院智能城市车”的最佳发明奖。2012年，《Dwell》杂志将他列为“当代99人”。他还曾参与过三本书的合著：《XXL-XS：生态设计的新方向》、《超级细胞：生物建筑》和《全球设计：异地设想》。其作品曾在现代艺术博物馆和威尼斯双年展展出。他在麻省理工学院获得了博士学位，在哈佛大学获得MAUD学位，在哥伦比亚大学获得MArch学位。近期，TerreaOne作品，可持续建设的蟋蟀避难所+模块式昆虫养殖场获得了LafargeHolcim基金会提供的2017年可持续建设奖。

Zack Saunders（ARCH[or]工作室的创始人兼Arch2O特约编辑）与Mitchell Joachim就一些问题进行了交流，包括：建筑界的伟大壮举、‘JAWS’与‘Piranha’问题之间的区别、从无到有的进行城市建设以及Terreay One的未来。以下文字摘自Mitchell Joachim即将出版的一篇文章：“设计与生活：生物技术建筑与弹性城市”，Maria Aiolova合编。

Mitchell Joachim, Ph.D., Assoc. AIA, [jo-ak-um] – Co-Founder of Terreform ONE and an Associate Professor at NYU. He was formerly an architect at Gehry Partners LLP, and Pei Cobb Freed. He has been awarded a Fulbright Scholarship and fellowships with TED, Moshe Safdie, and Martin Society for Sustainability, MIT. He was chosen by Wired magazine for “The Smart List: 15 People the Next President Should Listen To”. Rolling Stone magazine honored Mitchell in “The 100 People Who Are Changing America”. Mitchell won many awards including; AIA New York Urban Design Merit Award, Victor Papanek Social Design Award, Zumtobel Award for Sustainability, Architizer A+ Award, History Channel Infiniti Award for the City of the Future, and Time Magazine Best Invention with MIT Smart Cities Car. Dwell magazine featured him as “The NOW 99” in 2012. He co-authored three books, “XXL-XS: New Directions in Ecological Design,” “Super Cells: Building with Biology,” and “Global Design: Elsewhere Envisioned”. His work has been exhibited at MoMA and the Venice Biennale. He earned a Ph.D. at Massachusetts Institute of Technology, MAUD Harvard University, MArch Columbia University. Most recently, Terreform ONE was honored by the LafargeHolcim Foundation by receiving a 2017 Acknowledgment Award for Sustainable Construction for the Circket Shelter + Modular Insect Farm.
Zack Saunders (founder of ARCH[or]studio and Arch2O contributing editor) and Mitchell Joachim share thoughts on heroic feats of architecture, the distinction between a ‘Jaws’ problem and a ‘Piranha’ problem, building cities from scratch and the future of Terreform ONE. The following is an excerpt from a piece included in his forthcoming book: “Design with Life: Biotech Architecture and Resilient Cities”, co-edited with Maria Aiolova.




蟋蟀避难所。模块式昆虫养殖场。在良好的经济环境下，养殖场可以引进一种先进且极端卫生的技术，在当地捕获昆虫，以生产食谱中的蟋蟀粉。Terreform ONE设计。Art Works for Change主办／Cricket Shelter. Modular Edible Insect Farm. In an advanced economic setting, this farm can introduce a sophisticated and ultra- sanitary method of locally harvesting insects for the production of cricket flour in fine cuisine recipes. Terreform ONE. Sponsored by Art Works for Change.

ZS：记得本科的时候，建筑师们会向我们讲述他们的建筑，而教授会将这些重要建筑师的项目展示给我们看……但是，直到我偶然看到像约翰•海杜克（John Hejduk）或利布斯•伍兹（Lebbeus Woods）这样的建筑师的作品，我的思想才真正开始变得开放，对建筑的概念也开始扩展。事实上，您现在声名狼藉的“ meat house”墙壁部分无论何时都让我印象深刻。我猜想当今的许多建筑师对扎哈•哈迪德（Zaha Hadid）或弗兰克•盖里（Frank Gehry）都有类似的想法。

MJ：在我看来，盖里绝对是美国的英雄，他做到了一切。扎哈和盖里是过去的榜样……建筑师对自我、所有权、创新是如此着迷，以至于我们倾向于以一种与科学完全不同的方式来进行设计，而科学事实上运行于标准之下。如果你是一名科学家，打算提出一些全新的东西，或者推翻一个被普遍接受的原则，那么你最好有一些严谨的证据来支持你的观点。在建筑学院，如果学生想要小至细节的模仿弗兰克•盖里的音乐厅，不出两分钟就会被教授批评，除非他们专注于特定的结构连接，其目的是改善整个结构体系。

ZS: I can recall when I was an undergraduate student, architects would come and give talks about their buildings, our professors would show us important projects by important architects … but it wasn’t until I stumbled upon the work of architects like John Hejduk or Lebbeus Woods, that my mind really began to open and my conception of what architecture has began to broaden. As a matter of fact, your now infamous wall section of the ‘meat house’ wasn’t lost on me either at the time.  I can imagine many architects today harbor similar notions about Zaha Hadid or Frank Gehry.  
MJ: Gehry is definitely an American hero in my eyes, you name it he’s done it. At the same time, the Zaha figure, the Gehry figure are models of the past … architects are so fascinated with ego, ownership, innovation … we tend to operate in a way that is very different from that of the sciences where they actually work in canon. If you are a scientist and you plan to present something that is entirely new or overturn a principle that is generally accepted, you had better have some serious evidence to back up your claims. In architecture school, if a student were to copy Frank Gehry’s Concert Hall down to the last detail, except they focused in on specific structural connections with the aim of improving the structural system as a whole, they wouldn’t last 2 minutes in a pin-up before they were berated by the faculty. When you get out of school and have practiced for a while, you realize that it’s almost all about that ‘2%’. Heroic feats of architecture do something novel with that ‘2%’.


Vitro Meat Habitat。这是一个建筑方案，利用3D打印猪身上提取的细胞，以形成真正的有机住宅。设计希望建筑可以成为“不伤害任何生命的庇护所”，因为在实验室的外皮生长过程中，没有任何生命受到伤害。Terreform ONE／In Vitro Meat Habitat. An architectural proposal for the fabrication of 3D printed extruded pig cells to form real organic dwellings. It is intended to be a “victimless shelter”, because no sentient being was harmed in the laboratory growth of the skin. Terreform ONE.

我越来越多地听到这样的说法……标志性的建筑师，或者说领军人物，是过去的榜样。然而，这种“孤独的天才”对于激励个人的行动，促使人们去做一些新奇而重要的事情来说可能是必要的。自我、所有权和创新都有助于人们的自我认知……领军建筑师和他们的追随者之间的关系可能类似于工作室或小组及其成员之间的关系。从这个意义上来说，个人标志性风格与群体风格是相同的。也许除非个体消逝，蛇（追随者）会成为一具无头尸体（没有方向的组织）……

建筑电讯派（Archigram）作为有各种想法的个人组成的联盟，曾经（而且现在仍然）是相当成功的，他们对于Terreform ONE有很大的启发，比如Peter Cook和他的插件城市，Ron Herron的行走城市……之前蛇的比喻在这里就不适用了。这里用九头蛇来比喻似乎更准确……当然，标志性风格确实以团体形式出现，但九头蛇在失去头部时仍不会死亡。事实上，还可能会成倍增长。Bilbao的首席设计师在盖里的工作室从事设计20年，然后创立了自己的工作室……遗憾的是，没有被关注。同时，Rem非常支持他的“孩子”，个人的标志性风格就是以这种方式被延续的。

几年前，我在伦敦Peter Cook的Crab工作室实习。这对我这样的年轻设计师来说是一次很好的经历，事实上，当时的我还是一名学生…… Peter和工作室的联合创始人Gavin Robotham都是亲力亲为，比起办公室，这里更像是一个工作室。即便如此，也有无数次，大多在他们不在的时候，我感觉到设计师们并不一定是在创造建筑，而是在生产Peter 和Gavin可能的或想要设计的那种建筑概念…… 通过这种方式，教学造就了风格，甚至成为了专业时尚。以你提到的Rem或我的Peter为例，这个领军人物扮演的是培养者的角色，而不是专制者，然而，一种特定的教学的思想仍在传播，因为那些为他们工作或与他们交往的人渴望取悦他们。

我们对学校的教学非常感兴趣，因此对这一课题进行了为期5年的研究。我们还广泛地研究了建筑学院的排名系统。获得高的等级意味着什么？是什么造就了好的建筑学院？为什么我们不能为那些想学习建筑的学生，根据其兴趣和喜好，设立一个定制的排名系统呢？预备的学生可以填写一份调查报告，这可能有助于缩小选择范围，从而弄清楚他们是否会在像Sci-Arc或普林斯顿（Princeton）这样的学校取得优异成绩。我曾经看过一次TED演讲，演讲者讲述了一位研究人员是如何改变番茄酱产业的，他没有寻找完美的单一种类酱汁，而是为人们提供了多种选择(1)。

同时，我希望这样一项调查的“答案”不会像道格拉斯•亚当斯（Douglas Adams）那样直白，就像‘42’一样 (笑)……因为大学的经历有点像钻研未知，发现自己，以及随之而来的一切……

（笑）是的，当然。

I hear that more and more … the idea of the signature architect, or figure-head, being a model of the past. And yet, such ‘solitary genius’ may be necessary to inspire individuals to act, to do something novel and important. Ego, ownership, and innovation all contribute to ones’ identity … the relationship between the figure-head architect and their followers might just be analogous to that of the studio or group and its members. Individual signature is the same as group identity in this sense. Except perhaps when the individual dies, the snake is just a headless corpse …
Archigram, a group that inspired Terreform ONE, was (and still is) quite successful as a league of individuals with various ideas … Peter Cook with his plug-in city, Ron Herron with one that walks … The snake euphemism doesn’t hold here. A multi-headed hydra seems more accurate … The signature does exist at the group level, sure, but the hydra doesn’t die when it loses a head. In fact, it probably multiplies. The lead designer for Bilbao worked in Gehry’s office for two decades, then struck out on his own and opened his own office … sadly, nobody cares. At the same time, Rem is very supportive of his ‘children’, the signature individual supports a kind of lineage in this way.
I did an internship at Peter Cook’s Crab Studio in London a few years ago. It was wholly a good experience for me as a young designer, in fact I was still a student at the time …  Peter, and the studio’s co-founder Gavin Robotham, are very hands-on and run the place less like an office and more like a studio. Even still, there were numerous times when, mostly in their absence, I sensed that fellow designers were producing not necessarily architecture but their concept of the kind of architecture that Peter and Gavin might do, or want done … in this way, pedagogy becomes style or even fashion in the professional one. With your example of Rem or mine of Peter, the figurehead takes the role of a nurturer, rather than a kind of authoritarian figure, yet a particular pedagogy is still propagated by virtue of the desire to please by those that work for them or associate with them …   
We have actually been so interested in pedagogy in schools in particular that we’ve been working on a 5-year study on the subject. We have also been looking extensively on the ranking systems in architecture schools. What does it mean to receive a high rank? What makes a good school of architecture? Why don’t we build a customized ranking system for people that want to study architecture, one that is totally geared towards the students’ interests and preferences? A prospective student could fill out a survey that could help narrow the options down which might clarify whether they would do well in a school like Sci-Arc, or Princeton, and so forth. I once watched a TED talk where the speaker illustrated how a researcher revolutionized the tomato sauce industry by not looking for the perfect sauce, singular, but by providing a multitude of options for people to chose from (1).
At the same time, I would hope the ‘answer’ to such a survey would not be so straight-forward, in the style of Douglas Adams,  something like ’42’ (laughter) … because the college experience is a bit about delving into the unknown, finding yourself, and all that comes with that …
(Laughter) Yes, of course.




回家的路（Homeway）。郊区的大规模外逃。这是一个将未来的美国住宅放在轮子上的方案设想；这些经过改造的房子将成群结队地涌向城市中心和后方。我们建议用智能的可再生基础设施来加固现存城市之间的高速公路。在未来，房子的形态将保持不变，但其位置会变得不固定。Terreform ONE／Homeway. The Great Suburban Exodus. A proposal to put our future American dwellings on wheels; these retrofitted houses will flock towards downtown city cores and back. We propose to reinforce our existing highways between cities with an intelligent renewable infrastructure. In the future, the physical home will remain permanent but its location will be transient. Terreform ONE.

关于TED的演讲“多样性与选择”，我记得一位演讲者举了这样的例子：在购买牛仔裤时有大量的选择，而他自己却找不到“完美的一条”。以此来说明太多的变化实际上会使人对自己的选择感到失望，因为人们对这些选择的期望越来越高(2)……他甚至认为，太多的选择可能会引发一种麻痹，使得人们无法做出选择。

我可以明确地看到牛仔裤的例子和在挑选建筑学院时做出正确选择之间的关联性。值得高兴的是，这个比前者复杂一些！进入建筑学院时，你是被作为未来的领导者来进行训练的，而不仅仅是商品的消费者或趋势的追随者。 他的名字是Malcolm Gladwell……是那个讲述意大利面酱料故事的人。我想用这个例子来说明的主要观点是定制，就像通过更多不同酱料的选择来实现。这可能是建筑学院可以从中受益的一个概念，不单是提供基本相同的东西。

我看到成熟的设计师以完成的状态展示他们的作品，例如，我看到Mitchell Joachim在TED上讲述其方案，展示了精致的图纸、远景和结构给我们看……但我看不出那些挣扎，选择，工作和研究的时光，比如“肉屋”，可能是……我想知道这其中有多少是被教导得出的，又有多少是设计师的“自我，所有权和创新”，还有多少是绝对不会放弃的东西……我认为这个问题很紧迫，因为我并不完全相信建筑教学是可能的……

Speaking of TED talks, variety and choice, I recall one where the speaker uses the plethora of choices available when shopping for jeans, and his own experience with not finding the ‘perfect pair’, as an example of how too much variety might actually lead to disappointment with one’s choice due to the increased expectations one has about how good those options will be (2) … he even argues that a kind of paralysis might ensue whereby a choice is not even made at all due to the overwhelming number of choices.
I can definitely see the correlation between the jeans example and make the right choice when it comes to selecting an architecture school. Gladly, one is a bit more complex than the other! When you go to architecture school, you’re trained to be a leader, not just a consumer of goods or a follower of trends. Malcolm Gladwell was his name … the spaghetti sauce guy. The main idea I wanted to illustrate with that example is that customization, rendered possible by a larger selection of distinct and therefore different sauces, for instance, might be a concept that architecture schools could benefit from, rather than all offering basically the same thing.
I see mature designers presenting their work in its finished state, I see Mitchell Joachim on TED, for instance, talking about his projects and showing refined drawings, visions, and structures … but I don’t see the struggle, the choices, the hours of work and research that went into making, say, the ‘meat house’, possible … I wonder how much of that is taught, how much of it is ‘ego, ownership and innovation’ on the part of the designer,  and how much is just sheer will not to quit … I think the question is a pressing one because I am not wholly convinced that teaching architecture is even possible …




插件式生态。城市农艺种植舱（Urban Farm Pod with Agronomy）。一个供个人和城市核心家庭种植，以及满足日常蔬菜需要的“生活”小屋原型。插入式生态舱球体采用机械碾磨，并用再生平板包装材料制成的下格栅结构。完全可操作的次灌溉系统和泡沫塑料板作为盆栽元素的套管，农业组织培养用于微繁殖。数字监测平台会将有关特定植物健康的信息传递到网络上。Terreform ONE。 顾问：Huy Buy, Greyshed。 摄影: Micaela Rossato／Plug-in Ecology. Urban Farm Pod with Agronomy. A prototype for a “living” cabin for individuals and urban nuclear families to grow and provide for their daily vegetable needs. The Plug-In Ecology cabin sphere uses a robotic milled rotegrity ball for the under-grid structure made of reclaimed flat packed materials. A fully operable sub irrigation system and a shaped foam panels serve as sleeves for the potting elements and agronomy tissue culture for micropropagation. A digital monitoring platform relays  information about specific plant health to the web.Terreform ONE. Consultants: Huy Buy, Greyshed. Photos: Micaela Rossato.

我坚信，建筑学不仅有一种教学方式。非常明确地说，我认为教育系统应该分两条轨道。第一条是提供建筑科学方面的教育，学生在4年内毕业，其中应该在建筑领域里至少有一年的实习经验，在此期间应该得到去世界各地进行建筑设计的许可。第二条是博士课程，在科学、数学和历史领域，这些学生将会花7年或更多的时间去到“兔子洞”里，去到被其他学科领域学生包围的工作室里，其目的是为人类知识做出独到的贡献。你能教一个领域的人如何像另一个领域的人一样思考吗？也许不能……没关系，最难做的永远是找到问题！是这样，斗争总是存在的，幕后的研究和努力对于任何不完全是垃圾的项目都是基本的，我们不必总是把这部分展示给世界看。如果你想做任何有创意的事情，坚持下去的意愿是绝对必要的。我想我也会因为分手而获得自我认知，然后和Maria Aiolova一同创立了Terreform ONE ！

Terreform ONE不仅将自己看作一个团体或集体，而是作为一个更大的社会和全球交流的一部分。我们决定超越设计工作室通常所做的事情：我们是非营利的，我们创建自己的学校，自己的竞赛，我们使用新的材料并进行深入的研究，我们的工作需要广泛的专业知识……为什么？答案是，为什么不呢？我们行动背后的一个主要动力是，质疑权威，质疑现状，以在城市中推广智能设计，并构建未来城市的新愿景。事实上，正因如此，我们开始以意想不到的方式成长。

I strongly believe that there isn’t just one way to do or teach architecture. Let me be very clear here, I believe that the educational system should be structured in two tracks. The first should offer an education in Building Science where a student graduates in 4 years and, with at least one year of internship in the field, they get licensed and go out in the world and design buildings. The second is a Ph.D. track, which has its equivalent in the fields of Science, Mathematics, and History, these students would spend 7 years or more going down rabbit-holes, in studios surrounded by other students making things, with the aim of making original contributions to human knowledge. Can you teach someone who should be in one of these realms how to think like someone in the other? Probably not … and that’s OK. The hardest thing to do is always to find the question! But yes, the struggle is always there, the research and effort behind the scenes is fundamental to any project that isn’t total garbage, but we don’t always have to present that part of it to the world. Sheer will to keep going is absolutely a necessity if you’re going to do anything creative. And I guess I get ego points as well for breaking off and forming Terreform ONE with Maria Aiolova!
Terreform ONE is thinking not only in terms of new chapters of itself as a group or collective but rather as a part of a larger societal and global exchange. We decided to go outside the bounds of what a design studio normally does: we went non-profit, we created our own school, we run our own competitions, we work with novel materials and conduct intensive research, we work with topics that require extensive expertise … Why? Because, why not? A major driving force behind our initiatives is that we question authority, question the status quo, in order to promote smart design in cities and construct new visions of what the city of the future could be. In fact, we are beginning to grow in unexpected ways because of this.




城市化布鲁克林（Brooklyn）2110。未来的城市。我们设计了一个强化版的布鲁克林，在其可达到的物理边界内为它的人口提供所有的基本需求。在这个城市中，食物、水、空气、能源、废物、交通和住房被彻底改造，以支持各种形式的生活。Terreform ONE／Urbaneering Brooklyn 2110. City of the Future.  We have designed an intensified version of Brooklyn that supplies all vital needs for its population inside its accessible physical borders. In this city, food, water, air, energy, waste, mobility, and shelter are radically restructured to support life in every form. Terreform ONE.

然而，至少在过去的五年里，美国郊区的人口增长已经加速，而城市中心的人口增长却在放缓(3)……若将城市看作一个项目，这座城市似乎已经死了，或者至少是在进一步通知之前被暂停……

Terreform X 作为Terreform ONE的扩展，不久将以私营公司的形式启动。团队正在为一个真正的城市设计大规模概念，我们对此感到非常兴奋。一家大公司的首席执行官和前纽约地区检察官Preet Bharara找到我们，就像他们说的那样，我们没有进行公开的会议日程，仅仅是会面和“聊天”。聊了一会儿后，他说：“我们正计划建设一座城市。”一些基本的前提，比如靠近水体这种概念，并没有在他们的脑海中出现……（你不能）列举一个主要城市，它既不位于海岸上，也不靠近河……但是我们对自己与自然关系的思考是如此的脱节，以至于我们提出这个问题之前，它一直没有被考虑在内。不管怎么说，他们的想法是，希望居民每年能得到8万美元左右的生活报酬，而人们将仅仅因为自己想工作而工作。他们如何避免人们搬到那里去榨光系统中的资源我不知道，但我肯定是需要某种申请程序的……毕竟公共地悲剧（Tragedy of the Commons）我们应该牢记在心。但是，设想一个城市能够体现环境意识设计的原则，在能源、交通、建筑、废物处理、食物生产和水的获取等方面都具有当地的可持续性……这所有的理念都是我们自Terreform ONE成立以来，所一直在研究和学习的，这对我们来说非常有吸引力。

这似乎不是一个建筑问题，而是一个社会问题，甚至是哲学问题……听起来你不仅仅是在建设一座城市，而是在建设一个完整的社会，从根本上来说就是这样的……

没错。我参观了最近在MoMA举办的弗兰克•劳埃德•赖特（Frank Lloyd Wright）展览……当看到他为Broadacre City画的画时，我不知道自己被什么所吸引，但是这些画中有那么多的想法，曾经被嘲笑为一种幻想……市中心的塔楼，四周环绕着果园和农场，无人机在各处飞行。这真的让我觉得郊区可能是没有被如今的我们认真考虑过的城市形态的另一种模式。是的，你正在建立一个社会。而且我认为大多数建筑师，不管是有意还是无意间，都会在建筑作品中植入自己的世界观……

And yet, for at least the past five years, population growth in America’s suburbs has accelerated while slowing in urban centers (3) … it seems the city as a project is dead, or at least on hold until further notice …
Terreform X will be launching soon as an extension of Terreform ONE in the form of a private company. We are working on a large-scale concept for an actual city, which we are very excited about. We were approached by a CEO of a major corporation and Preet Bharara, the former New York District Attorney, who wanted to meet and ‘chat’, literally that’s what they said, we had no stated agenda for our meeting. After chatting for a bit he says ‘we are planning to build a city’. Basic premises such as proximity to a body of water hadn’t crossed their minds … name one major city that is not either located on the coast or near a river … but we are so disconnected in our thinking toward our relationship to nature that this was not first on the list until we brought it up. Anyway, their idea is that inhabitants will get paid $80,000 or so a year to live there, and people will work because they want to. How will they avoid people moving there to leech off the system I don’t know, I’m sure there will need to be some sort of application process … the Tragedy of the Commons is something to keep in mind. But the idea of envisioning a city that can embody the principles of environmentally conscious design with local sustainability in energy, transportation, buildings, waste treatment, how you produce your food, where you get your water … all concepts that we have been working with and studying since Terreform ONE was founded, is very appealing to us.
It almost seems like less of an architectural problem per se and more of a social or even philosophical one … it sounds like you wouldn’t just be building a city but would be constructing an entire society, literally from the ground-up …
Exactly. I visited the recent Frank Lloyd Wright exhibit at the MoMA … I’m not sure what came over me at the sight of his drawings for Broadacre City, but there is so much thought in those drawings which were once laughed off as a flight of fancy … towers in the middle of nowhere, surrounded by orchards and farms, drones flying around. It really makes me think that the Suburbs might be another paradigm to consider in urban morphology that we really aren’t looking at seriously today. But yes you are making a society. And I think most architects, whether advertently or inadvertently, insert their world-view in their architectural works …




蝴蝶屋（Butterfly House）。黑脉金斑蝶栖息在密集的城市环境中。内外部景观和蜕变阶段。Terreform ONE／Butterfly House. A monarch butterfly habitat nestled in a dense urban environment. Exterior and interior views and stages of metamorphosis. Terreform ONE.

我们正在做一些之前从未做过的事情……就像在探索一个尚未开发的新领域一样。这个项目将我们的研究转向了石蛾及其水下建造 ；它们是自己栖息地的建筑师，幼虫用丝粘在一起的碎屑建造庇护所。那么我们能否训练它们找到环境中的微塑料和其他碎片，并在其建造中使用这些特定材料？不管怎样，我们正在设计纽约的一座建筑立面，而昆虫的应用已经渗透到项目中。我们决定探索一种在如此密集的城市环境中有利用意义的昆虫，于是我们偶然发现了黑脉金斑蝶，它是加拿大和新英格兰的本土物种。随着时间的推移，由于人类的活动，物种数量逐渐减少。我们设计的立面并不仅仅是建筑物的表皮，而是一个空间外壳，由适合居住和滋养蝴蝶的环境组成；那将是一个垂直的布满了黑脉金斑蝶的草地，位于纽约的中心！蝴蝶屋被设计为超薄、噪声消除且有利于为居住提供必要环境条件的建筑，同时还会成为本地环境健康的生态及环境指标；我们的想法是，如果建筑对于蝴蝶来说足够好，那么对人类来说也是足够好的（人类与蝴蝶达成良好共生）。

前几天我在看“Jaws”，电影的大部分内容都不是关于与鲨鱼搏斗，而是试图说服社会团体首先要做好与鲨鱼搏斗的工作。您在Terreform ONE的工作，我很想知道，其中有多少时间是在试图说服Amity的市长？这是一个要解决的问题吗？

“鲨鱼（Jaws）”是一个很好的例子，因为从中你可以看到一个明显的野兽，当然是以鲨鱼的形式表现的……当它开始吃人的时候，你就能发现这是一种威胁。事实上，我刚刚看了电影“食人鱼（Piranha）”，相比于“鲨鱼（Jaws）”，它非常糟糕，但在这里看来，相比于与一群鱼搏斗，与一条鱼搏斗不算什么……电影中充斥着大量的死亡，爆炸，一片混乱。我们真的没有鲨鱼的问题，我们有食人鱼的问题。Paul Kingsworth和蒂姆•莫顿（Timothy Morton）一直把这称之为一种Dark Ecology（黑暗生态）。 Kingsworth说，实际上，拯救世界是没有希望的，无论如何都为时已晚。 莫顿（Morton）把这个概念描述为食尾者（ouroboran），在谈到Deckard时，他从“Bladerunner”说起，他必须认识到，自己和追求的敌人是同一人……从这个意义上来说，Brody局长必须意识到他就是鲨鱼！Morton的思想对建筑师们的影响越来越大，他关于黑暗生态、超物质、自然终结的观点，为生态学甚至设计的概念提供了一个崭新的视角，而且他的作品非常容易理解。例如，他把超体说成是一种比个别城市更大的具体化的存在。城市就是这方面的一个很好的例子，建筑师们也开始学习如何运用这些概念。

在莫顿谈到人类与所有生物和非生物之间的相互联系时，似乎有一种期盼，那就是我们可能会照亮黑暗，或者说，唤醒宇宙的真相，最终重新思考我们与世界的关系。我认为你的工作与这一哲学理念紧密相关。另一方面，Kingsworth写到了一个不那么乌托邦式的憧憬，他说，没有什么能够阻止即将到来的和正在发生的危机“除非有某种重置：我们在人类历史上见过很多次的那种。某种程度的倒退到文明复杂性的较低水平。(4)”虽然起初看来这似乎很凄凉，令人沮丧，但他所说的这些时刻是人类历史上最重要的时刻之一，把我们从黑暗时代（Dark Ages）带到了文艺复兴时期，从中世纪带到这个开放的世界，等等。

重大（社会）运动，社会从黑暗中出现，以某种形式进入启蒙时代的时期，无疑是我们历史的一部分。但站在此刻，你看不到它是什么。人们称它为“破裂的时代”，也许破坏是必要的，但听起来还是有些令人失望……

We are working on something that I don’t believe has ever been done before … like finding a new territory that has yet to be explored. The project spiraled off from of our research into caddisflies and their underwater constructions; they really are a kind of architect of their own habitats, the larvae construct protective cases using detritus bonded together by silk. Could we retrain them to find microplastics and other debris in the environment and use that specific material in their cases? Anyway, we’re working on a building facade in New York and this work with insects has trickled into the project. We decided to research an insect that would make sense in such a dense urban environment and we stumbled upon the monarch butterfly, a native species to Canada and New England. Slowly over time, due to human activities namely, the species has slowly declined. The facade we are proposing is not simply a skin to the building but rather a spatial enclosure, consisting of a tempered environment to house and nourish butterflies; a kind of vertical meadow filled with monarchs right in the heart of New York! Designed to be super-attenuated, noise canceling and conducive to the necessary environmental conditions for habitation, the Butterfly House will also act as a kind of ecological and environmental indicator of wellness for the local environs as well; the thinking here is if it’s good enough for butterflies to flourish it’s good enough for humans.
I was watching ‘Jaws’ the other day, and most of the movie is concerned not with fighting the shark itself, but rather trying to convince the community that the work of fighting the shark needs to be done in the first place. Thinking of your work at Terreform ONE I can’t help but wonder how much of it is trying to convince the mayor of Amity that there is, in fact, a problem?
‘Jaws’ is a great example because there is a palpable beast that you can see, in the form of course of the shark … you are able to identify as a threat the moment it begins eating people. I actually just saw the movie ‘Piranha’, which is a very shitty film compared to ‘Jaws’, but here fighting one fish becomes less of a task than fighting a swarm … in the film there is massive death, explosions everywhere, it’s a mess. We really don’t have a Jaws problem, we have a Piranha problem. Paul Kingsworth and Timothy Morton have been talking about it as a kind of Dark Ecology. Kingsworth is saying, in effect, saving the world is hopeless, it’s too late to save it anyway. Morton describes the concept as an ouroboran one, speaking of it in relation to Deckard from ‘Bladerunner’, who must cope with the realization that he is one and the same with the enemy he is pursuing … in this sense, Chief Brody would have to realize that he is the shark! Morton’s ideas, which are influencing architects more and more today, of dark ecology, hyperobjects, the end of nature, provide a refreshing new look at notions of ecology and even design, and his writings are very accessible. He speaks of hyperbodies for instance as a kind of embodied presence greater than each individual part. Cities are great examples of this, and architects are starting to learn how to engage these concepts.
It seems where Morton talks about human kind being interconnected with all living and non-living things it has a sense of hopefulness that we might shine a light on the darkness, so to speak, awaken to the truth of the universe, and ultimately rethink our relationship with the world. I see your work as being closely aligned with this philosophy. Kingsworth, on the other hand, writes of a less utopic vision of the future, stating that nothing can stop the impending and ongoing crisis “barring some kind of reset: the kind that we have seen many times before in human history. Some kind of fall back down to a lower level of civilizational complexity. (4)” While this seems dismal and disheartening at first, these moments he is speaking of are responsible for spawning some of the most important moments of human history, and carried us from the Dark Ages to the Renaissance, from a medieval world to an enlightened one, and so on.
Major movements, periods where societies emerge from darkness into an age of enlightenment in one form or another, are part of our history for sure. But when you are at the moment, you can’t see it for what it is. People are calling this the ‘Age of Disruption’, perhaps disruption is necessary for change, but it sounds a bit disappointing …


后碳城市-州（Post Carbon City-State）。重新划分循环经济。纽约市的海平面上升预计在20世纪20年代达到11英寸，20世纪50年代达到31英寸。我们设想曼哈顿曾经是一个藻类生产工厂，用于隔离碳和提供氨基酸，将其用于食品生产和生物物质，能够改革增长的能源生产。曾经的街道变成了宜居空间蜿蜒的动脉，嵌入了可再生能源、低科技、绿色机动车辆和生产性营养带。Terreform ONE。 顾问: Pablo Berger。 摄影: Micaela Rossato／Post Carbon City-State. Rezoned Circular Economy. New York City’s sea level rise is projected to reach a high estimate of 11 inches by the 2020s and 31 inches by the 2050s. We imagine the void that was once Manhattan as an algae production plant for sequestering carbon and supplying amino acids for food production and biomass for energy generation capable of reformative growth. What were once streets become snaking arteries of livable spaces, embedded with renewable energy sources, low-tech, green vehicles for mobility and productive nutrient zones. Terreform ONE. Consultant: Pablo Berger. Photos: Micaela Rossato.

您最近参与了首尔双年展的一场辩论，在那里谈到了环保概念设计经常面临的挫折，以及大公司在这方面所扮演的角色，一些是关于他们的人为支持……

掠夺性拖延，是的。刚开始的时候，我们不可能确定自己是在和谁战斗，尤其是当像Shell 和BP 这样的公司口头上支持可再生能源，甚至为研究投入资金的时候。这些公司每天都在赚取惊人的利润，所以答案是肯定的，20年后我们会改变，但是今天呢？一切照旧。所以从根本上说，食人鱼问题不仅仅是一群相同的鱼群向你扑来，而是一群不同种类鱼的问题……

你必须非常敏捷，甚至……

你得有弹性！

‘You recently were involved in a debate for the Seoul Biennale where you talked of the set-backs often faced by environmentally conscious design and the role played by major corporations in this, something about their artificial support … ‘
Predatory delay, yes. When we first started out, it was impossible to define who we were fighting, particularly when companies like Shell and BP are giving lip-service to renewable energy and even contributing money towards research. Day to day these companies are making incredible profits, so the answer becomes ‘sure, 20 years from now we’ll change, but today? It’s business as usual. So basically the Piranha problem isn’t just a swarm of identical fish coming at you, its a swarm of individually different kinds of problems …
You have to be quite agile, even …  
You have to be resilient!   


弹性滨水区（Resilient Waterfront）。对前军舰进行适应性再利用以建立一个河岸缓冲区的研究，该缓冲区将处理纽约港的涨潮和洪水管理问题。其目的是将自然沉降技术与退役美国海军舰艇的回收利用结合起来，以恢复自然水域边缘，恢复多样化的外形，并减缓水道的水流速度。这一重新设想的综合模式滨水区设计基于一个简单的前提——基础设施不是将水排除在外，而是为了让水进入。Terreform ONE／Resilient Waterfront. An investigation of adaptive reuse of former military vessels to create a riparian buffer zone that deals with issues of surges and flood management in New York Harbor. The goal is to combine the natural sedimentation techniques with the recycling of retired U.S. Naval ships to restore the natural water edge, to reinstate a diversified profile and to slow down the watercourse. This comprehensive model of the reimagined water front is based on one simple premise- instead of keeping the water out, the infrastructure is designed to let the water in. Terreform ONE.

尾注：
1.        Malcolm Gladwell. ‘选择，幸福与意大利面酱’. TED.
2.        Barry Schwartz. ‘选择悖论’. TED.
3.        US Census Bureau
4.        Kingsworth, Paul. ‘Dark Ecology(黑暗生态)’.

END NOTES:
5.        Malcolm Gladwell. ‘Choice, happiness and spaghetti sauce’. TED.
1.        Barry Schwartz. ‘The paradox of choice’. TED.
1.        US Census Bureau
1.        Kingsworth, Paul. ‘Dark Ecology’.